This is kind of an unfortunate situation. I can't wait for L4D2 and I'm sure I will pick it up day 1 but I don't think they needed a sequel so soon.

I think the lack of continued support that the 26,000 members of the l4d2 boycott are afraid of is pretty much being confirmed in this line. "But all-new original content for the original game may be limited, as 'the timeline for Left 4 Dead 2 is so sensitive, and the team has a head of steam right now for the game.'"

Gabe says that they will include new community features, and finally get the modding tools working, but with their team working on Left 4 Dead 2 there's nobody to make new maps and characters for the original, which are both things I think a large part of the L4D community expected. If Valve had a bigger development team I'm sure they could do both at the same time, but from what I remember they move members back and forth between their games all of the time. For example, when L4D was being worked on the updates for TF2 pretty much stopped for quite a while because most of their team was working on the new game and nobody could really push through with new maps and characters. I imagine the exact same thing will happen in this case.

All of that said, interoperability will be a godsend and I can't wait to bust zombies over the head with a frying pan.

People keep making assumptions about what is possible. the announcement was designed to surprise and excite, not to define the sequel or it's relationship to the original.
It's very weird that so many people are jumping to negative/worst-case assumptions. I'm assuming the best, because I think these guys are the most interesting game changers in the industry. (and I thought this sequel was the coolest game news from E3)

1. If Valve was curious whether their experiments so far have earned them a loyal fan base - what do they make of this small group of loud whiners, and the resulting splash of negative news stories. (a fairly small group = 25K names on a silly petition = about 0.8% of the 3 million suggested customer base. I haven't yet joined a server where any player was upset about a sequel - which I know is less than 100 proven satisfied customers - yet it's still hard for me to believe these skeptics/complainers are at all serious). If Valve makes larger policy decisions based on the "i'm entitled" whiners (or the "let me tell you how you're company will handle this" whiners), I hope they'll let the world know. ... It'd be interesting to read an in depth analysis of how modern entertainment companies manage their uncivilized online fan base. (none of this meant as a dig on you David).

2. Apparently this change in product support/update/rollout strategy was ok'd as part of an experiment: Today's G4tv interview suggests that Valve decided to see what the public would make of a year-ish update period (as opposed to TF2's semi-monthly bits) - http://tinyurl.com/ntl64f
I hope they stick with it, as a defining part of the L4D IP. (and i hope they focus on making the sequel a offer more of an alternative gameplay experience, so people feel it is not just replacing the first entirely).

3. it would be cool if a series of L4D sequels offered variations in gameplay (and different campaign maps), but all characters were allowed to interact online - regardless of which game you owned. Specifically, i think it'd be interesting if these new cajun L4D2 characters didn't have infinite handgun ammo, but were the only ones able to carry melee weapons.

It'd be a curious new industry model if they patched the first game to let that community play the original map set - but allowed in characters from the sequel(s) to add some variety.
(and to further daydream, it'd be sweet to see a L4D3 next year, set around valve's offices in seattle, with a third form of gameplay uniqueness)

4. Whoever is covering(/managing) the so-called "upset" is failing to differentiate the PC from Xbox players. I'm a PC player, and couldn't be more thrilled that I get to have more delicious L4D campaigns so quickly. I've been following the "upset" with bewilderment since MS's press conference. But I think I'm seeing that most of the angry voices are from Xbox players. (who apparently want more DLC? my Xbox's HD is full, and I find I'm sick to death of managing my DLC). I'm eager to better understand how the community is divided between these platforms.

"I think I'm seeing that most of the angry voices are from Xbox players."

I've witnessed the opposite. Console players are used to the annual sequel model, and I think have been more accepting and excited for a new L4D within this time frame.

But die-hard PC and Valve fans who know Valve as proponents of fostering a community around a specific game over a long period of time, maximizing a game's life and value, are the ones who I think are more upset. Valve's just saying, wait and see what our plans our before the hatred begins.

I do agree with you though in that it'd be interesting to know exactly where PC and Xbox 360 owners stand on the issue, because it's not wholly clear, which is one reason I didn't jump to any conclusions in the piece.

Of course they will keep supporting L4D, just like they still support the first Half-Life.

The problem is that the game wont see any new official campaigns, characters or weapons like they originally intended. This support they talk about is just bugs and balance fixes.

I personally think it should have been a massive expansion and not labeled a sequel. I've got no issue paying for it. But honestly, it's not as if the new Director couldn't have been patched over the old one and all the new features added into the current content. That or include the old content with the new stuff, they have said they're thinking about it. Especially because of the 360 users having to change disks and what not. I want to play the old content with the new features.

It is the PC players who are the whiners. It's a Steam group they created to protest, so that kind of proves the point. Exclusive Xbox players are used to paying 50 bucks and getting no support.

I own the game for PC and Xbox, I will probably own L4D2 on both also. I like the .8% stat to show how small of a group of whiners this is (It's probably lower than that even, 2.5 mil on Xbox and ?? on Steam = ~4-5 million I would guess). It's one of those vocal minorities, but man, they got the negative word out quick and far.

I think it's ludacris for some megalomaniac gamers to demand that their sequel be DLC instead of a true sequel. I watched L4D2 at E3 and it argueably is as much of an improvement on the original as Gears2 was to Gears1.... Yet no one cried about that?

It's funny too that people, who love L4D, are upset they're getting a sequel. Baffles my mind.

Well, those 360 owners should stand up and complain.

People are not upset they're getting a sequel, people are upset the sequel is going to split the both player and modding community. One of that group's wishes is that L4D2 turns into a expansion (paid or free, doesn't matter).

Also, Tony, check your dictionary, I'm pretty sure having an opinion isn't the same as whining.

Wait. It all stems from: how much DLC is DLC before it becomes an entirely new game.

But we can sidestep that question by asking, "Is Left 4 Dead uncompleted?"

The Lobby system is one of the most broken aspects of Left 4 Dead. You can't join other 2 man groups. That means your trio of picked ppl will own most pick up groups. Noobies will get slaughtered and expert players will ragequit. Lobbies frequently are not joinable. And no noob is gonna go to console to join a custom map or special server.

I just want a good server/lobby GUI. Counterstrike has a better a server gui and that game is 10 years old.

I like valve because they make good software. They don't make 'good enough' software. I give a lot of leeway to l4d because its a pioneering product. But the game is not finished. I dont care about maps. I dont care about new weapons.

I will not pay full price to participate in a beta. We're not arguing about content. We're talking about a bad Lobby system. You could say, Buy the sequel, it'll have an improved lobby system. You can't expect them to be perfect in 1.0.

True. But this is PC. This is 1.8. We forgive easier for beta products as long as it ends up proper.

You can do yearly releases for L4D, like EA does Madden. I don't care. Whatever. But dont release a sequel without fixing your original. Because the sequel's gonna have the fixes.

"have fun with l4d? Look at l4d2, we have the lobby system that's not broken. Come buy that."
"why don't you just charge me 500 dollars right now, and i get 10 consecutive L4d sequels."
"er...are you willing to do that?"
hell no.

@Tony Dormanesh:
"I watched L4D2 at E3 and it argueably is as much of an improvement on the original as Gears2 was to Gears1.... Yet no one cried about that?"

The games are fundamentally different in their purpose of play. Games with robust single-player campaigns alongside some multiplayer support are a whole different beast from focused multi-player support with a single-player option of all or some of the MP content. Furthermore, L4D is made more unique in that it is very explicitly reliant on replay value where as Gears of War is less so because of the linear storyline and gameplay. Another driving force for its success was the promise of continued support through free DLC of which has been very little, in fact partly being things that from my recollection were intended to be in the original release anyway (the 2 other VS maps)!

Gears of War 1 and 2 may not be a whole lot different in how they play, but you also have a ton more content than L4D offers because they aren't relying on a high replay value. With L4D2 coming out and the prospect that the communities will be split, that both games will be updated separately, and that ultimately L4D2 will always have the better updates and features because it, and this is a feeling even amongst those not boycotting, "includes everything L4D should have had in the first place", people are rightfully angry. To an extent, everything in L4D2 was expected by people to be DLC. I, for one, would have been comfortable paying for an add-on pack to get the new campaigns and characters (say $10-$15), but everything else proposed and revealed so far seems like things that should have been DLC from day 1. What TF2 has gotten since release is a LOT of stuff, enough to warrant an expansion pack by today's standards, but it was all free, and by time every class pack is released, and along side any new Valve maps and game types and everything else they're adding, TF2 will comparatively have released most if not all of L4D2 entirely for free. TF2 set a great standard for continued support, and L4D has not delivered in the slightest, and now it's being perceived as "abandoned" in favor of L4D2.

You should understand there's a difference between legitimate complaints and whining.

I don't know... I never expected everyone to look at the Orange Box, which was amazing value, and try to set it as the standard of what's to come from here on out. So by the same token, I wouldn't look at the support given to one specific game that wasn't given to others and cry foul.

Unless the TF2 support everyone is talking about also applied to every other Valve product (it might, don't know, I just know I keep hearing about TF2 support) then I think the real problem is that TF2 is amazing value, whilst L4D and everything else are just standard value. The issue would be in people comparing the wrong way around.

Consider Left4Dead2 an expansion pack to Left4Dead1 with improved graphics, characters and a new campaign. People who have this expansion pack can play with all the Left4Dead1 stuff. If you don't buy the expansion pack, you don't get any of the new stuff. If you liked L4D1, you'll probably like the expansion pack. You should consider buying it. =P

The End.

Unbelievable!
Valve changes currency from dollar to euro for all european countries (except GB), even those that actually don't use the euro, and essentially raised prices 40%-70% above local retail prices!
7 months later, valve still ignores all questions about this!
(and banned several people posting about this on their forums)
And now with L4D2, essentially ripping of their customers again!
... but they respond almost instantly!!?!
What happened to you Valve!?

Didn't mean to upset people.. but yea, checked the dictionary and the L4D2 boycott is still considered whining. Starting a group and making demands is a little more than having an opinion.

What Alexander said before is true, TF2 is an amazing value, you cannot expect that kind of support from most games. I think the TF2 support is different also, TF2 updates are new maps, weapons, etc. L4D2 is new characters, new mechanics, new stuff under the hood.... Maybe it was too much new stuff to be DLC?

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I just thought it was kind of outrageous how much of a fuss 26,000 people made over a game they love getting a sequel. And I guess they couldn't have made such a fuss if other people didn't agree, right? So a lot more than 26K believe that they're getting screwed by Valve... Good for them. I will be happily playing L4D2 this November, and I bet most of the boycotters will too.

i stumbled across this and read a few of these and i guess none of you really understand why any of us are doing the boycott. We were promised, when we payed our 50 whopping bucks for this short but fun game, that it was going to be constantly updated and added to so we wouldnt have to play the same 4, yes 4 levels that we always play over and over and over again.
Why should we have to pay the 50 dollars for what is essentially the DLC that they turned into L4d2.
Tony - "maybe its too much to be DLC"???!!!! ARE YOU SERIOUS!!!
NO SUCH THING
Steam offers ANY game over DLC its not even an issue. And the extra stuff being DLC isnt the issue!
ITS THE FACT THAT WE HAVE TO PAY FOR IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
WE WERE PROMISED ALL OF THIS FOR FREE WHEN WE BOUGHT THE FIRST ONE!
Ya, there are a few other stupid complaints about the lighting and whatever, but im sure theyll make it all work nicely... I just think L4d2 ISSSSS my DLC for L4D, the greedy bastards just did this as a cash grab because L4D did well. And all of you idiots that don't know anything about it are going to fall for it. You KNOW valve only works on ONE big thing at a time.