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For
your Sega world view going forward, where do you see the balance between those
original, triple-A titles and the work-for-hire or license-based titles?
Where's the balance for you?
SJ: I think it's a real blend. The Marvel
business is going to be fairly significant for us for a few years, but we're
going to grow out the kids and family part of the market again. It's where Sega
has always been traditionally strong and a large part of the market is in that
space right now, so we're building that out very consciously with products like
Samba de Amigo and that kind of stuff
coming along.
But we're also striving to improve on the
original content. Our relationship with PlatinumGames is a big part of that. We
really want to focus on... when we build original content, we know, in the
market now, it's got to be good to be successful. It's got to be really good to
be successful and be competitive, so we've got to spend more money building
original content.
I think the balance has probably been to
even out to one-third licensed product, one-third original product, and one-third
Sega IP.
With
the Platinum announcement, that was made here in the west first, as far as I
understand.
SJ: It was made in the west first. Yes,
that's right.
How
is the Japanese side thinking of the western market right now? Because to me,
that was a big deal, that PlatinumGames would announce in the western market
first.
SJ: Well, Sega as a company is very
profitable in the western markets, and the Japanese gaming market is very
difficult right now. So Sega in the west is looked on very favorably. We're
doing well, we're growing, every year our market share increases, we're putting
out more product, and we're making strides to improve quality. So we're
checking a lot of the right boxes for a big, important Japanese developer like
PlatinumGames. They're extremely willing.
One of the reasons why they split from
Clover and the various Capcom studios in the first place was to have more
influence on how their games were brought to market around the world. I think
they've often felt that apart from perhaps Devil
May Cry, a lot of their output hasn't really gotten quite the commercial
success in the west...
It's got the critical success, but maybe
not the commercial success it deserved, and they want to be a big part of
making sure that their products going forward are big sellers, so they've been
really active in working with our marketing teams in the west on building plans
out. All of their consumer research they've done in the west. They haven't done
any consumer research on their games in Japan.
It's all being done in the west because they really want to make sure their
games resonate over here.
And
the games that all of those creators have worked on have traditionally done
better here, actually.
SJ: But not as well as they should have.
How
big is your U.S. development staff?
SJ: Secret Level is 120 people, then we
probably have about 60 full-time people in the product development group. Then
several thousand QA people.
How
important do you think U.S.-side internal development is going to be for you,
going forward?
SJ: I think that whilst we're still looking
and are always open to further studio acquisitions, we're probably not going to
grow out the internal development more than it is now. We're establishing a
pipeline that we're pretty happy with, and Secret Level is going to be building
out some different kind of content which we'll be talking about quite soon --
not just next-gen stuff.
I don't think we'll be looking to grow internal
development much more than that. However, if a potential studio acquisition
came along that made sense, then we would absolutely look at that.
Sega
Japan: Making it Work in the West
How
do you feel you can maintain quality when including the Japan side and what sort of titles you
can bring over from there? They're sort of on a different wavelength.
SJ: Because of what's happened in the
Japanese market recently and how fast it's differentiated and fractured from
the western market, we're able to be selective about what products we bring
over from Japan.
We actually have a lot of say in the origination in some of the products now,
so something like Valkyria Chronicles
on the PlayStation 3, we had a lot of involvement in building that game, so it
doesn't feel quite as niche-y as it would've if it was built a couple of years
ago, for instance.
Sega's Valkyria Chronicles
How
can you foster the creativity on the Japan side? I don't know if the western
side is able to advise the Japan side, but it sounds like they're
looking to the west for a bit of assistance. So how can you assure that
something like Valkyria Chronicles is
going to be the rule rather than the exception?
SJ: All the Japanese games that ship in the
west now have to go through a greenlight process in the west, so they have
regular reviews. We have an advisory board of people across the organization --
sales, marketing, and creative -- who have qualitative input into the stuff
that's being built in Japan.
Valkyria Chronicles and Sonic Unleashed have had a lot of input
from the west on the kind of games they were. If Valkyria Chronicles had been built three years ago, it would be a
very different product.
What
sort of things are you doing as part of the quality initiative? Who is
overseeing these sorts of things?
SJ: We recently split our product
development department into two, so we have a production silo and a content
silo. Now we're about to appoint a VP of content, and on the way we're putting
in an art director. We've got a creative director already.
So we're setting up
a team specifically around qualitative analysis, measurement, and input on all
the games we're doing, both internal and external games. This team will work
with the producers hand-in-hand.
Before, we measured things by milestone, date,
and budget schedule, not so much qualitatively. That's something which we're
now doing. We're bringing in industry veterans to do that -- people who have
done that before and know what they're doing.
Excellent.
Do you want to say who any of them are?
SJ: Not yet.
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Oh, and best of luck in their other new properties (Just so long as the let Sonic be Sonic).
As a group we've been sacrificing our personal lives and health to ship products for Sega. We didn't expect thank yous, but we definitely never expected a slap like that.
There's more I could say about his statements, but I'll hold my tongue because it wouldn't be professional to discuss these things in a public forum.
And to rail one of your own developers in public? I mean what does he hope to gain by saying this? Credibility??? If you paid good money for B-studio, shame on you... if it's true or not, why do it in public???
plenty of companies put out bad games, but i have never seen a publisher rail on their own developers in the press - never. Very unprofessional, and short sighted and self-defeating. I'd be surprise if their was anyone left at Secret Level after reading that.
I feel sorry for platinum games if you think sega can get you more exposure to the west than capcom... just looking at the track record capcom was the better choice... 3 million sellers to sega's 1 (mario/sonic olympics)...
i'm a long time sega fan and i have to say everything out of simon's mouth has been pure rubbish... its like he spouts a couple of buzzwords and thinks he's said something.
Go back to lucas.
Phantasy Star Online need a new come back on home console too, a true nextgen one...
I dont really like the new Sega, sure codemned was good, but where are all the old franchise?
Its like with Sega Rally revo, im sure Sega forced the developer to build the game like the old arcade racing game. And the game had good review, look at metacritic (75), and it was their first game. But they sold the studio... who is going to bring back daytona usa now ? and all the beloved racing game from sega...
I really dont understand, gamer want more old sega game, but not like they were back in the days, with an arcade mode and thats all.
The only game we wanted like the old days was sonic, and every times its was the one they choose to change and ad more stuff...
Fan want more of Jet set radio too, that doesnt mean it need to be set in japan with japaness music (love the game music) but it could be set in europe citys, with a more western feel for the music.
im really looking forward for the next sonic game, i hope the night stuff isnt a big part of the game, because i really love the look & feel of the day part with sonic !
Oh and the Valkyria look great too, a demo to try it that would be awesome !
Also, to single out and undermine a particular department in public is extremely unprofessional, and I'm shocked he has been in the industry for as long as he has with such a poor display of judgment.
The awesome Iron Man console game fans, gamers and designers dream of cannot be created AT ALL from start to finish with only 14 months of development time in the schedule. That is insane. There is no room there to release a game that can meet the expectations of fans, and at the same time address the critical issues that always arise when developing for all major systems simultaneously while still catering to the limitations a license brings. Add to that the design restrictions imposed by the license provider, and bottleneck communication between license provider, publisher and developer on any idea to make the game better, and it can easily be seen why the game turned out like it did despite restless hours of work from dedicated professionals (I don't know anyone at Secret Level, but I can tell you people don't crunch and miss family and good health just for the fun of it). Since Mr. Jeffery is a veteran in the industry, we can all agree he was very well aware of this, as it's not an uncommon occurrence when developing licensed titles in the industry; especially those that must be released prior to a blockbuster movie.
If Mr. Jeffery knew this, and wanted a quality title that was also a success, he could have worked with Marvel to reach a reasonable middle ground. However, since his skills as a business man are not "world class" enough to release a license title of BOTH quality and financial success (Golden Compass, The Hulk, Iron Man... 0-for-3 so far), then he should at least take the responsibility for, as CEO of the US branch of Sega, allowing the title to be developed under such restrictions for a guaranteed critical failure.
First of all, I can't see that anyone has singled out designers as being bad, but simply not as 'world class'. If people are offended by this, they should at least acknowledge that it has been pointed out that all of this happened over the course of and due to a short 14 month project and then at least take some accountability for the idea that this isn't the worlds best game design anyway. There's no reason to hold that title up and be offended when someone suggests you haven't proven yourself to be 'world class'.
Also, comparing them to Creative Assembly is merely a way of saying that one studio has created original, top selling IP and another one is a work for hire organization. Secret Level, even before being involved with Sega was exactly that. There is nothing wrong with being a work for hire organization...many organizations have tried to be more than this and have lasted only 12 months, so have some self respect for what you might have achieved. These comments seem fair to me.
Here is a well worded criticism by someone not afraid to use their real name: http://lowfierce.blogspot.com/2008/08/sega-slaps-one-of-their-developers.html
An employee or representative of such a studio speaking his or her mind about the issue, which may include harsh words against a top Sega executive, could cause the poster to get fired; or worse, it could cause a strain in any relationship between Sega and the studio, including the breaking of a deal.
However, if the poster has to either keep quiet OR give their name when posting, then why not choose to keep quiet? Well, that's because it's more important to read sincere comments (as a result of anonymity) than it is to know the name of the individual giving the comment. There is no point in knowing the name. Also, bear in mind that the person could easily be supporting a family as a game developer, so it wouldn't be his neck alone on the line for making such comments. That is far from being a coward. It's just being smart, and knowing what could be at stake.
I've said it before Sega needs ME as their CEO. :)
I don't agree with Jeffery's vision. Focusing on "casual gaming" doesn't necessarily equal profits and some profits doesn't mean you're making the most of the companies talents. I don't buy that crap about "we need to be a western company." That sounds like a bunch chatter. I applaud Sega for publishing games like condemned, but I don't believe their failures were due to the fact that they were "too Japanese." Learn lessons from the past Sega for the love of god. History seems to repeat itself. One thing Sega needs to do better is marketing. I think they are a bit out of touch. Jeffery's is wrong about Sonic completely. It's true that mascot gaming is not what it used to be, but people haven't been buying sonic because they are not made well. I could give you several bad examples, but the Sonic DS games are a good example of what they should be. Stop saturating the market with bad Sonic games and I have a feeling sales will pick up.
I feel bad about Iron Man now. I did talk smack about it, but I had no idea it's development time was only 14 months. I'm totally blown away that a solid game could be produced in such a short time. Imagine if they had 18 months.
Badmouthing developers is the worst thing any CEO could do. I was excited about Golden Axe, but if the CEO doesn't think it's great, why would I? I'm still going to get it cause I have faith in the developers.
In my opinion Sega has a reputation to upheld. Being profitable isn't good enough. They must be great AND profitable. I'm sure everyone thinks I'm mental about Sega, but I want to be able to love them again.
Anyway regarding his comments on SL; they are harsh and unnecessary in a public forum. Also ironic... I know a chap at Sega who was fired by Mr Jeffery & co. last year for daring to write in public that management at Sega had lost the plot.
In regards to SL - while they may not be at fault for Iron Man in terms of the development schedule they had to work with; they have no such excuse with Golden Axe. I'm not even talking about the MP, I mean the game play experience in general - I've played it a fair bit and it's simply awful. Sega are not blameless, but nor are they entirely to blame. We can all make excuses (valid or not) but when all else is stripped away the reality speaks for itself.
You're completely right; I though of adding a caveat for employees as soon as I had hit the submit button.
I don't see anything constructive in your postings. What are you trying to say? That Secret Level puts out poor quality games?
So what? I feel like you don't understand how this industry works at all.
Every studio falters. Every publisher has made a bad call. This article is itself a clear example of a very powerful and experienced industry veteran making a bad call - a mistake if you will - in disparaging an internal studio. As you can see from the responses of his peers, even if the remark is warranted it is still in bad form, particularly from a CEO. It is a mistake I am sure he will not be making again in the near future, in much the same way that Secret Level as a studio is also learning from its mistakes. This article is probably a very painful reminder to their employees and managers that their studio still has a very long way to go before they earn the consumer and peer respect that we all desire as creatives. Kicking them when they are down is demeaning & unwarranted, especially when the venue does not allow them a proper response.
Sometimes studios make mistakes, or experience growing pains on small projects. Sometimes they make colossal blunders on big IPs with huge budgets. Studios are just creative men and women doing their jobs, after all: working, learning, growing and gaining experience. That some of the responses to this article imply long hours of overtime and crunch only does more to sign to myself and other vets that a lot of mistakes were made across the board in the creation of these two titles. And if that implies that Secret Level as a company "sucks" then I have some sad news for you, my friend: this industry sucks in general. "Less crunch and better planning" do not just magically appear from the ether of creativity and grant game developers good quality of life and great games they can be proud of: it takes a lot of blood, sweat & tears to make up for mistakes early on in development, and sometimes even that isn't enough for a team to pull through and make something worth your hard-earned dollars. I don't see anyone from Secret Level coming onto these forums and advocating you buy their products; not that it is even their call whether their games make it to market. It is the publisher's call whether or not they see something in a game that is worth selling. It is for that reason alone that I withhold my own judgment on Golden Axe. If it is a sub-par product like Iron Man then the onus is Sega's to pull the product from stores and give the consumer what they demand instead or nothing at all. But honestly Anonymous, historically your opinion isn't worth that much to them, or to any corporation for that matter. Apologies, but they will still market the product to the subset of consumers who just do not care and will still buy the game as long as Golden Axe or Iron Man is in the title.
Which again makes me question your postings: what would *you* have these people at Secret Level do, or have Sega or Simon Jeffery do for that matter beyond this? Line up the team and have them shot for making a couple of bad games? "You are going to fall even more;" is just a cruel and unintelligent response. I apologize if a couple of IPs dear to you as a consumer have been damaged, but I think that you will survive with only a few tears shed. After all, we've all had to live through the Star Wars prequels.
I disagree that Secret Level can never be a Triple-A studio, simply because - as Grassroots Gamemaster would cite - 'Secret Level' is just a corporate shell. Through the collective efforts of hiring managers, Sega corporate and Secret Level internal personnel, I'm sure a group of qualified game-makers can be assembled under their roof to make great games. Who knows, they may already have the secret sauce on premises: sometimes people and teams need to fail and to painfully learn from their mistakes on their way up the development ladder. American developers, it seems, always want to re-invent the wheel. With Sega's acquisition of Secret Level not more than five years old, Secret Level is certainly a young studio by industry standards; and if they chose to build their own engine (a choice I wouldn't necessarily agree with) then even more reason why their early games are not or will not be critical successes.
That is not to say that I do not question the judgment of any publisher that would allow a fledgling studio access to one of the biggest IPs of the year (Iron Man) - but then that seems to be the way the story goes in this industry. Young studios are willing to take on insane schedules or difficult publisher demands in an attempt to finally make it to the big leagues. It's a common 3rd-party dev mentality/causality, and one that I believe is endemic to the way in which games are currently published, marketed, and sold.
It is rare that you see a success story of stepping-stone development: I cite Rockstar's Table Tennis as an example of iterative development done the right way (build a small game on a new engine before upgrading to something big like say a GTA 4). But then Rockstar can make games this way because of the confluence of great sales and marketing, a proven track record with a team of vets, and just a bit of luck. The rest of us aren't always so lucky, and so 'big' games like Iron Man and Golden Axe will continue to hit the shelves and un-impress us (and the development team themselves) with tech-demo scores. As long as publishers are more willing to take your money than they are to take the loss and stop development on games that do not offer the consumer a satisfying experience, this trend will continue.
But that fact does not detract from my main point that it is possible for teams to do better over time. Is Resident Evil 4 a good game? Do you know what game that Capcom development team make just before making what is widely considered one of the greatest games of all time?
'P.N.03'.
Have you even heard of this game? It has a 63 Metacritic rating. I hear it has a cult following, but even Mikami-san did not necessarily approve of his own team's game: '"This game doesn't have so much catchy point" "I wanted to put little more time into it" and a lot more.'
What would have happened if Capcom management looked at that score and said, "Well this team is obviously terrible.......and can never amount to anything........Let's all take them out back and tell them they SUCK and then kick them and laugh.........That'll teach 'em to try to make games, losers!"
But they didn't did they? Instead they fostered continued growth and trusted the team with further games to develop, and eventually there was greatness. I think even Simon Jeffery understands this, otherwise he never would have backed the purchase of Secret Level in the first place. I only hope that his comments in this article reflect a current level of frustration in his organization with the obvious blunder of giving a new studio two big titles to cut its teeth on, rather than follow a more sensible track of delayed cost-recoup paired with smaller games to start. I stress that I do not advocate discontinuing support for that studio in the future. As a developer who has seen many teams cut down just as they were really gaining their stride, and as someone who hates to see poor decisions like that made in haste above all else, I hope that both Sega and Secret Level are taking active steps to learn from their mistakes and strive towards making every title a Triple-A consumer experience... not just 80s and 85s.
Good teams and good developers learn from their mistakes, Anonymous. Contrary to your post's assertion, I would speculate that a post-mortem for both Iron Man and Golden Axe would reveal a sincere effort to make games that were true to their IPs that fell short for one reason or another (probably several). And that any reference to the 'reality' of a situation is premature at this point until we get to hear from the team(s) themselves. I for one would welcome a Game Developer Post-Mortem for both Iron Man and Golden Axe games that we can all share and learn from as developers, publishers, marketers, etc.
Until then I welcome continued constructive discussion on this thread concerning issues germane to game development. Please take your consumer comments about the quality of past games or games under development to sites like gametrailers.com where they are more appropriate.
there are great talents at secret level. his comments are out of line. if they need to reshuffle to put a better group together, so be it, but seriously what has simon ever done in this industry that was considered AAA quality. Nothing. He has more failures under his belt than just about anyone.