How did you personally stay solvent for four years of not releasing a game?

JM: I live pretty cheaply, and Everyday Shooter was good enough to tide us over. Actually, no, wait. That's not true. We got a grant from the government. That's how I got him to quit his job.

And then Sony picked it up a year after that; after the grant ran out, we're like, "Oh, shit!" That makes sense. Because Everyday Shooter didn't do that good.

Do you think it's going to be another four years until your next thing?

JM: I don't know. I guess we'll find out. I don't want to do a crazy game, though; I want to do something simple. At least coming out of this, I want to do something simple.

It's funny, because visually it looks like a simple game. So people could perhaps have the mistaken impression that is a simple game.

JM: This is the thing. I can't do my crazy graphics shit, because then information gets lost, you know what I mean? Information is core to the visual. So in Everyday Shooter, all you needed to know was "don't touch stuff," right? But in here, you have to know some stuff you can stick to, some stuff you can stand on. Just it being a platformer makes it a lot harder.

And also because there's an editor. A lot of the stuff in Everyday Shooter is actually composed. It's not actually random, you know what I mean? It's like you know it will happen at these specific times. It's orchestrated, to an extent. But with the level editor I have no control over that, so I have to be super careful about what I'm going to do visually.

Everyday Shooter

Did you build everything, all the single player levels with the same editor that provide to people?

JM: We used our shitty PC editor, which is more fully featured, as sort of our test bed But it's really shitty. It's like on Vita, you can just select stuff, but on PC, you get to a point where you're just trying to select just one thing and it doesn't work.

So we're actually really -- and I know this sounds like PR bullshit -- but I'm super excited to get our Vita editor fully featured, so we can start using it instead of the PC one. And you can use the back touch. So you can look at the level while you're making it. It's a lot better.