Does anyone here actually know someone that has had these supposed issues that is not from the internet? I know lots of people with a PS3 and I don't know anyone with the problems caused by the update.

Also I heard that the problems were just with games like Uncharted malfunctioning. Is this guy claiming that the update bricked his system of ruined the hardware? That is just crazy. I haven't heard a thing from anyone like this.

Yes, that would be moi. A few weeks ago my PS3, while watching Watchmen Blu Ray, stopped 'seeing' any optical disk at all. No Blu Rays, no DVDs, nothing. I re-installed and still, no luck. It's a boat anchor. i've been putting off contacting the scum at Sony because I know it's going to put me in a very bad mood. How coincidental that at $150 for the repair, buying one of the new modelss at $299 is a viable option. And my machine was just barely over a year old, with very light use. Mainly playing 1 movie a week on average.

That is weak sauce Robert. I have a 80GB PS3 and I updated to firmware 3.0 with no issues at all. I wonder what is triggering the issues with he hardware. My PS3 played Uncharted with no issues and is still playing movies with no issues. This is certainly strange. Though I would put away the tin foil hat as I really doubt Sony is messing people's PS3's on purpose. The danger for being found out and being sued would be to huge, not to mention potential criminal charges of fraud. No corporation in their right mind would do such a thing.

Robert Allen

from what I understand Sony's has 1 year manufacturers warranty so if its just under one year old and you still have a proof of purchase then you should be OK

As for this case, I can the judge throwing this lawsuit out. People should be aware that when you download software, even from a trusted source you're essentially doing it at your own risk.

It's pretty much a mandatory upgrade.
Without the upgrade the machine will no longer perform as advertised.
(And as far as I know there's no downgrade path.)

I have no idea if the software upgrade "causes" the problem because I only have a sample size of 1. However if you search the Internet you will find numerous cases of this problem of the optical drive 'disappearing' from the machine. In some cases it comes back after reformatting the disk, but not in my case.

If it's not the upgrade then it's just crummy hardware/software (RROD anyone?)

Sadly my machine is about 3-4 months OVER 1 year old, not under, so I'm screwed as far as the warranty.

And I'm baffled as to how Andre could say that I have the option of downloading "trusted software" in this case. Or on any console. Since we don't know much about what the upgrades do, we don't know what happens if we don't download them. If you don't download you get bugged periodically to download (as my 360 is doing right now.)

Anyone who thinks that a manufacturer would not cover up costly warranty issues must be new to the world, as Microsoft did it with the 360, and car manufacturers have done it many times.

Oh, and Alan, I have a 40 GP PS3. Correct me if I'm wrong but the two are substantially different? Doesn't the 80 GB have PS2 compatibility?

I just checked. My PS3 died on Aug. 12. I'm not positive, but I think the 3.0 update came out around Aug 18 (which means it's not what killed my PS3.) But PS3's losing the ability to see the optical disk is a problem out there. Percentages unknown.

Oh and there was one other thing Microsoft covered up, that was the 360 scratching disks. The drive they'r using doesn't have soft standoff pads to keep it from happening if the box is moved while the disk is spinning. There's a video out showing some Swedish (I think) guys reproducing and then diagnosing the problem.

I miss the old days when consoles didn't have these kinds of problems. XBox360 even has a light that tells you it's dead, which I think is pretty sad.

These law suits always sound so strange when people file them.

"My console broke. I demand $50,000 in damages".

Crazy people.

Robert, yes the 80 GB has partial PS2 BC to about 85-90% of all PS2 games. The only one I have had any issues with was SSX:Tricky. :( That made me a sad panda. Good thing my daughter still has my old PS2 Slim. :)

Otherwise I do believe they are almost exactly the same. I would say Sony is not going to release and hard numbers on the optical disk issue unless they are sued for it in court. And even then I imagine the records might get sealed. I sum it all up to the regular failure rate that all consumer electronics experience. I understand that almost all of consumer electronics fail at an average rate of around 5-8% from what I have read. That is about the level at which PS3's have failed from what I have read around the internet.

Downfall of consoles was when they started having hard disks.

I have to strongly disagree Robert... Hard drives have allowed games to be patched and updated with new content. It also allows me (as a consumer) to be able to save the game I'm playing without going out and buying a memory card.

In the PS3's case, it allows developers to cache data to speed up load times which allows you to bypass the inherent flaw of optical drives of being able to read only one file at a time.

Human beings are pattern seeking animals. You update the firmware and the console crashes within some period of time and your brain makes the connection. Nothing seems to indicate that there actually is a connection, but with millions of PS3s out there, it has happened to enough people coincidentally that it feels like there is a pattern even if there isn't.

Pre-internet this wouldn't have happened because it would have been unlikely that anybody that you know personally would have had the same problem. Or at least, you'd recognize that the number of people with problems compared to the number that did not was very small. With the internet - the information you get is that thousands of people have the same problem as you - but with no context as to the overall picture.

The ability to patch software also encourages the "ship it!" mentality, possibly resulting in games that are too buggy to otherwise ship. Though I admit I'm curious if the vaunted Sony release gauntlet has changed since PS1 days.

James, memory would allow the caching of which you speak, though possibly more expensive. Since I am not privy to the nature of the PS3's virtual memory (if any) I can't comment much more. The advantage of RAM instead of disk is, you can power down the machine and get it working again. Few viruses or persistant bugs can infect it. I find that having to "reinstall" a console just goes against the grain. I expect to do that with a PC, MAYBE. (Never had to reinstall the OS though to fix a game.) Doing it with a console just peeves me.

I agree with Robert C. wholeheartedly. But as the old saying goes, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." implies, there could also be cause and effect. One thing the new patch allegedly gives is simultaneous output on multiple video outputs. Doing that with high end audio/video usually requires advance planning and hardware. If they did it with software, I could see a potential problem(s).

Alan Rimkeit wrote "The danger for being found out and being sued would be to huge, not to mention potential criminal charges of fraud. No corporation in their right mind would do such a thing."

Is that like no huge music company would ship out audio CDs that when played on your PC silently installed a rootkit as part of their DRM that made your machine about as secure as a wet paper bag?

I agree with some of the earlier posters - the ability to patch and upgrade a product is a two edged weapon. Sure it can help you resolve unforseen problems and make drivers more stable or considerably faster... but it must also contribute to the "ship it now, patch it later" pressure for some games publishers.

@Kren Cooper -

The difference between Sony bricking PS3's on purpose and the whole RootKit DRM fiasco are not even in the same ballpark and you know it. That was my point. Do you know what would happen if any company got caught bricking older systems on purpose just for the opportunity of selling newer systems? The idea is crazy. So please don't take my words out of context as you obviously did. You also cherry picked the quote of what I said as well.

I also tend to agree that the whole idea of patches and upgrades to firmware hold a certain risk. But I also think that the benefits general out weigh the risks. Sony has had some issues with firmware updates. So what? It is getting taken way out of proportion. Nintendo has had some issues of their own with bricking Wii's after an update to the firmware. Are they going to get sued next?

The only problem I have had thus far with my PS3 40gig has been when Home updated this past week and I could not log in. I kept getting a hangup when the internet portion tried to load. It was easily fixable though after many complained. Speaking on complaining over the net. It becomes hard to gauge when people are telling the truth about hardware hangups or bricking problems when using the net as a source. For instance. I get updates about PS3 news all the time through social networks like Twitter and facebook. About two to three post down form any update, whether it be a game or whatever, some person arbitrary post about their bricking problem, leaving no details or asking for no help. It becomes hard to gauge if that person is just a troll, or if that person has a real problem. It takes the steam out of the real conversation.

BTW I agree with Alan on his point about knowingly bricking hardware. No company in their right mind would do that to a consumer and expect to reap a good reputation.

My 360 died on me the day Bomberman came out, I was so mad as I was so excited to play Bomberman online as it has long been one of my favorite franchises. Less than 2 weeks later I got a console back from Microsoft and has been fine ever since. I pretty much abused my 360 with all night GoW sessions, it took a real pounding and I was sad when it died but I must have had hundreds and hundreds of hours of play out of it.

My PS3 on the other hand was used only for Resistance, Warhawk (which I gave up on because of the crappy servers) and for watching Blu-Rays. I estimate I got less than a 100 hours of use out of it in over a year. It just stopped working one day, I think it died of neglect. It was a 40GB and I think I broke his little heart with all the love I showed for my 360.

Everyone has a different story and while Microsoft definitely seem to have had a much higher failure rate, they treated me well, Sony don't want to know.

@ Robert

The Xbox360 scratching the disks wasn't hidden by MS. In fact it was in the instructions that if you move the console when a disk is in it that you should remove the disk before turning on the console, or it will get scratched.

I just know that before the update, I was playing a game. Then I updated to 3.01, put in a disc, then it didn't work.

It may not have happened to a number of systems, but I doubt people would be making up everything that's happening on the forums.

I'm not trying to bash Sony. My PS3 was my favorite system, and I would just love for another firmware to come out to correct this, or at least allow the users to downgrade to a firmware that worked for them.

Same thing happened to me. The upsetting part is that Sony, not known for their software development expertise, forces a download on you on a fairly regular basis. When one goes bad, and of course they do go bad, they tell you that Sony values their customers and that they don't see anything that points to them, so please pay $150 + tax to have your console repaired.

It's total crap. I've had mine for over a year, I played Metal Gear and watched maybe 40 hours of blu-ray total. Then I put in a disc, it reads it, I go to play it, the console says I need an update, I update, and the console restarts and I no longer have a functioning drive. I'm out of warranty and Sony just shrugs its collective shoulders at me. They can bite it.

As far as lawsuits being filed by crazy people looking for $50,000 because their console died, I believe that's designed to have the manufacturer take them seriously. I know that my attempts to be taken seriously on the phone with them were in vain.

"[S]everal PC shops are finding the problem is the firmware has been overspeeding and burning out BD drives".

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3updates&th
read.id=148749