Each has its own niche and its own audience. It is a natural state of affairs.

I don't know about that Maria. If you saw $10 (~3 of $30M average budget = 10%) on the floor would you think, "That's chump change I can't be bothered to bend over and pick it up..."

Money is money and publishers are losing out on these deals every time one of them breaks past their goal. It is very interesting to see how Kickstarter is changing the landscape, though it does seem that currently it is mostly traditional games on a shoestring budget that seem to be breaking into the large dollar signs.

@ Benjamin No I don't think that, I seriously doubt I'll ever see that much money in my bank account, but I get the impression how big publishers talk about needing to shift a minimum of 6million units, minimum of half a million subscribers etc that $3.5m is what they spend on doughnuts and beer for meetings. They roll about in so much money, that mere mortals can't even comprehend what it's like to look down our noses at $3.5m.

I'm not saying publishers don't like money, I'm saying they don't like spending money to appeal to a small audience which makes a small amount of money. To date, Obsidian received 68,000 backers, you can't tell me that number at a discount price product is in any way comparative to 3-9 million sales at retail price big publishers expect?

I remember reading how Eidos/Crystal Dynamics were disappointed the latest Tomb Raider only sold 6 millon units a few years ago. The word "only" is what disgusted me most. It's comments like that which reinforce my belief.

Publishers are driven by investment. Investors are driven by their ROI (return on investement). If this thing makes any money, then the ROI is going to be huge, since the initial investment basically consists of whatever was spent outside of the Kickstarter money.

If enough of these projects do well, the money men are going to start looking into why. They'd be happy to invest in a larger number of high-return projects than a few large low-return projects.

Maria, you are referring to the 70,000-ish backers of the digitally-distributed Project Eternity as small potatoes compared to multi-million selling $60 retail titles. Not a fair comparison. The big publishers like EA have already shown that they have a great deal of interest in "mid-level" $15 and $20 games (with budgets comparable to, or often much less than Project Eternity), as shown by their very large presence on XBOX Arcade and PSN. Surely they would not be making that investment if they did not consider that sector of gaming to be a vital part of their revenue.

And yet, one of the biggest publishers around, EA, took notice of Wasteland 2, snapping it up for their Origin service as well as giving Kickstarted games 90 days free on their service.

They smell money.

And if you've been following PE, Obsidian mentioned that a publisher approached them about using Kickstarter, wanting to simply to take Obsidians profit yet letting KS finance the development. Which of course they refused, since they were planning on Kickstarting themselves.

Maria - I just did a quick calculation that I think you'll find interesting. Obsidian's kickstarter raised $3.5 million from 70,000 players. If a game sells 70,000 units for $50 each, do you know what that adds up to? Surprisingly enough, it adds up to exactly $3.5 million.

From a publisher's perspective, this is pretty impressive - Obsidian isn't out there begging for money, and giving away copies at half-price just to get some backing. They're getting $50 per unit, which no publisher can even dream of (since they don't get the full retail price - there's all kinds of costs and middlemen to pay off first). Instead, Obsidian got 70,000 people to pay above full price to a pre-order a game that doesn't exist.

Not really, EA started from these small "chump" change games and built itself up to an empire. The question is if there is still demand for these type of games. Publishers are quite gun shy about investing 30-40 million into what they see as a dead market (ie iso PC RPGs). So if Project Entirety succeeds, publishers will be more willing to fund such games.. It's not how much the game cost but how much it will make. If Project Eternity pulls in 20-30 million in sales, i doubt any publisher will scoff at that considering it cost about 4 million to make..

The optimist in me would like to believe this. The realist in my is more skeptical.

This game is playing primarily to nostalgia. Given that the playerbase that would feel nostalgic about it isn't as large as other markets; not small, but not huge. The nostalgia market is super tricky as well. In some cases it can pay off huge (bringing new audiences old feelings etc) and in some cases it can fail miserably (why play a game that mimics a 10-15 year old game but learns nothing from modern advances).

It's really easy to alienate a nostalgic playerbase and really easy to disenchant an audience that doesn't have a nostalgic investment already.

It will be interesting to watch to say the least.

edit: Maria, yes that is what I meant. Edited all my nastalgia/ics to nostalgia/ics :p

They currently have just under 70k backers.

Assuming the game ends up being decent, getting 100k-500k sales would not be difficult at all, especially with all the publicity they've gotten so far.

I'd be very surprised if Obsidian sold a significant amount of copies at launch, I don't doubt they will sell and especially if all the reviews are positive. I just have no faith in modern gamers getting enthusiastic about an isometric, roleplay focused rpg that doesn't have lot's of voice work or overheats their video card and let's them shoot heads in multiplayer.

P.s. Michael, I think you mean nostalgia.

I'm highly likely to get the game on release, I just didn't feel the need to support the Kickstarter. I wouldn't be surprised if there are a great many people out there like myself.

@Maria, FTL (another kickstarter project) was at the top of the Steam sales charts for a few weeks after it launched, and that game has even less mainstream appeal.

I totally agree :)

Except it's not an old school RPG by any means. 15 years old is not "old school". It's like saying Pearl Jam is classic rock. Sure, in comparison to the stuff today like Nickelback it is, but not really compared to Led Zeppelin or Pink Floyd or The Who or even Def Leppard and Motley Crue.

By contrast, a true old school RPG from the designer of Wizardry 8 is not going to be make it's kickstarter (stalled out about 20% of the way there)

"Except it's not an old school RPG by any means."

Are we really going to argue the semantics of what "old school" means... OK, fine then:

"When Obsidian announced Project Eternity with promises of OLD SCHOOL isometric RPG gameplay in the same vein as Baldur's Gate and Planescape: Torment, the floodgates opened.
-- source
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/120139-Update-Project-Et ernity-Sets-Ki
ckstarter-Record-as-Most-Funded-Videogame

Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to present the biggest videogame Kickstarter ever: Project Eternity. With less than 24 hours to go, Obsidian's OLD-SCHOOL RPG has surpassed the impressive $3.33 million bar set by Tim Schafer's Double Fine Adventure.
-- source
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/project-eternity/1226417p1.html

That's it! Obsidian's Project Eternity Kickstarter has finished with $3,986,194 pledged. This means Project Eternity, an OLD-SCHOOL fantasy RPG project from the longtime developer, has earned more contributions than the $3.3 million by Double Fine Adventure, the Kickstarter project that kicked off this whole "year of the game."
-- source
http://www.joystiq.com/2012/10/16/obsidians-project-eternity-kicks tarter-conclud
es-at-3-9-millio/

google "project eternity old school rpg" and you'll get plenty of hits... just because YOU don't think it's "old school enough"... by the way all the artists you mention are not "Classic rock"... Now Chuck Berry, THAT is classic rock.

"By contrast, a true old school RPG from the designer of Wizardry 8 is not going to be make it's kickstarter (stalled out about 20% of the way there)"

Exactly how is "Shaker" going to be more "old school" than project eternity? Brenda and Tom focus more on all this ancillary stuff than give me a clear picture of what they are going to produce and perhaps that is why they don't seem to be getting the requisite attention and funding. (Not that they are too old school)

What Michael DeFazio said. I pledged and I love old school games like Planescape: Torment. Bring it Obsidian!!

@Jeremy Reaban - I think you are referring to Super Old School RPG's a la Might and Magic, the original DnD games, and Bard's Tale. :P Brenda Brathwaite is doing that gig with her fellow Super Old School dev's. I await her game as well! :D Game time is like dog time, it passes very quickly. LOL

I see a lot of overtime in their future...

Without having to make cinematics for EVERYTHING hanging around their neck like a Wheatstone, I'd guess they'll do alright.